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April 7, 2025
Transcript – ABC Radio Darwin Breakfast
7 April 2025
E&OE
ADAM STEER: So there you go, the Prime Minister Anthony Albanese calling in to ABC Radio Darwin Drive on Friday. We have reached out to Peter Dutton to come on breakfast this morning, but he is unavailable. So in his stead, Shadow Minister of Home Affairs and Coalition spokesperson, James Paterson. Mr. Paterson, welcome to ABC Radio Darwin. You announced-.
JAMES PATERSON: Thank you for having me.
ADAM STEER: You announced you would buy back the port. Do you now agree it was a mistake by the CLP government to lease it in the first place?
JAMES PATERSON: Yes. And over the last few years, I've said that on a number of occasions. I don't think it was ever in Australia's national interest for the then-territory government to have leased it for 99 years to the Landbridge Group, and had the federal government had the power at the time to deal with it, I think it should have. But because it was a lease from a territory government, it didn't pass through the Foreign Investment Review Board. And the Morrison government subsequently changed the law to make sure, in the future, if there were any other acquisitions like this, that it would have to go through the Foreign Investment Review Board. All we can do now, though, recognising that that was a mistake, is fix it. And that's why we want to first try and facilitate a commercial transaction to transfer the lease control to an Australian Government approved operator. And failing that, we are prepared to use the compulsory acquisition powers that the Federal Government has to take back control over that lease.
ADAM STEER: So what information are you using to decide that it was a mistake to lease it in the first place? Where are you getting the advice to say, we need to take it back from Landbridge?
JAMES PATERSON: I have always thought that it was a mistake. I wasn't in the Parliament at the time when that decision occurred, and every time I've been asked about it over the last nine years since I have been in the parliament, I have said it was a mistake. I think it is a mistake, I don't think it should have happened. And the reason why I think it's a mistake - and I know Peder Dutton shares this view - is that the Port of Darwin is a strategically important asset. Just because of the geography of Darwin in the north of Australia, but also because of the defence precinct next door and also because we have significant ship movements in the area and of course the significant presence of our American friends, through their rotational presence with the Marines. It is not in our interest to have a foreign authoritarian government linked to the operator of that port.
ADAM STEER: I understand that, but I think, as you'd be aware, the federal government got a report 18 months ago into the lease of the port and the risk or not of Landbridge on that lease, and the result was nothing to see here. So I'm just wondering this is just personal opinion by you and Peter Dutton or is it based on evidence?
JAMES PATERSON: Yes, I'm aware of that report, and I'm aware of the Prime Minister's comments not long after that he thought it was fine for the Port of Darwin to remain in control of the Landbridge group. I didn't agree with that report then. I don't agree with it now. I think it is self-evident to any Australian who's watching the deteriorating global security environment, the contest of great powers in the Indo-Pacific and the increased risk of conflict in our region that it is not in our interest to have such a key and strategic asset being linked to a government that is a potential future adversary of Australia and its allies in our region. It just doesn't make sense.
ADAM STEER: So how exactly do you plan to buy it back?
JAMES PATERSON: At the very first instance, we do want to seek to facilitate a commercial transaction. We have made it clear to Landbridge that it's our intention to ensure that it is transferred to an Australian Government approved operator. And I hope, having made our intention clear and our willingness to use compulsory acquisition powers, that they would agree to participate in a commercial negotiation to transfer ownership of the lease. But if they refuse to do so within the first six months of a Dutton Coalition government, should we be elected, then we will use the very significant constitutional powers that the federal government has to compulsorily acquire the lease.
ADAM STEER: Is that a good move, particularly given the unpredictability with Trump and the US? Wouldn't we be much better off strengthening our ties with China rather than trying to create another fight? Half a billion dollars is a lot of money.
JAMES PATERSON: Well, I think particularly because of the deteriorating security environment, it's even more important that we take back sovereign control over this key asset in an uncertain world, where there is that strategic competition in our region, where there are heightened tensions, where we have the largest peacetime build-up since the end of World War II, which is being conducted by the Chinese government right now, that it's just not in our national interest to have that key asset controlled. So we're even more determined because of that uncertain environment to move and to move quickly.
ADAM STEER: So you have spoken to Landbridge, we're under the understanding, well, Landbridge has told us the owner still hasn't heard from either party, you've spoken to them?
JAMES PATERSON: No, I haven't spoken to Landbridge. I'm not saying we've spoken to Landbridge, but we have made it clear publicly with our announcement that we intend to compulsorily acquire the asset if Landbridge doesn't cooperate in a commercial process. They would now be in absolutely no doubt about our position and our view on that.
ADAM STEER: It's nine to nine on ABC Radio Darwin, and there are claims that someone in the Liberal Camp leaked this information to Labor, drawing the Prime Minister to call into our radio station Friday afternoon. Is there merit to this? How concerning is it for the campaign?
JAMES PATERSON: No, that's not true. I saw that claim being made on Insiders yesterday by Nicky Savva. It's baseless and not supported by evidence. The Prime Minister got a leak. This happens in politics sometimes. We're pretty sure we know who was responsible for that. And I think actually he made an error when he called in to speak to your colleague on Friday afternoon, he wasn't across any of the details. He hadn't done the work. He wasn't able to answer basic and reasonable questions asked by your colleague. And then again, two days later, at a press conference when journalists asked him similar, reasonable questions. He deflected, he obfuscated, he just wasn't able to answer. And I think in an uncertain world, we need a Prime Minister who's across the detail on national security, and Anthony Albanese is not.
ADAM STEER: We are still talking about a situation caused by your conservative colleagues in the Northern Territory in the first place.
JAMES PATERSON: Yes, you're right. I think that government made a mistake. I don't think they should have sold the lease. I think it was not in either the Territory's interest or the national interest. And what your listeners can have confidence in is that Peter Dutton will always put our country first. He will always put our national interest first. He's willing to admit when our colleagues get things wrong and he's willing to act on it to fix it.
ADAM STEER: You're on ABC Radio Darwin. It is seven to nine. Adam Steer with you. Right across the Northern Territory, James Paterson, Liberal Senator for Victoria and Coalition spokesperson. Meanwhile, Peter Dutton has apologised over the Coalition's policy to force more public servants to return to work, calling it a mistake. Why the backflip there, Mr. Paterson?
JAMES PATERSON: Well, because we got it wrong, and we've heard very clearly the feedback from families in a modern economy, just how important flexible work is to them, how critical it is to make their modern, complicated, busy lives work. And when we get it wrong, we'll own up to that, we'll take responsibility for that, and we will fix it. And we are now not proposing any changes to work from home arrangements at all. We never were proposing it for the private sector. We were only ever proposing it for Commonwealth Public Service based in Canberra. But we're not even going to proceed with that now because we have heard from Australians how important it is to them.
ADAM STEER: But you are sticking to the 41,000 jobs being taken from the Federal Public Service.
JAMES PATERSON: In three years the Albanese government has increased the number of federal public servants even more than the Rudd and Gillard governments did in six years, and it has hit the budget to the tune of about $7 billion a year. So through a hiring freeze and natural attrition over five years, we'll reduce the Commonwealth public service back to what it was when Anthony Albanese was elected, because we don't think Australians are getting good value for money from the massive increase in public servants.
ADAM STEER: So that was the same time that you were employing 52,000 consultants, and they are often those same public servants on more money to do individual projects. Will you be ruling out employing a mass of tens of thousands of consultants if you win the election?
JAMES PATERSON: There are some tasks that the Commonwealth Public Service performs that only a public servant can perform, and there are other tasks that are better performed by contractors who've got specialist skills by the Commonwealth. We don't have an ideological approach to this; we want to get value for money for taxpayers, and we want efficient public services. And despite the big increase in the numbers of public servants over the last three years, I don't think any Australian will say that they've got better service from the Federal Government. In fact, the waiting time at Services Australia when you're dealing with things like pensions has blown out on this government's watch, it's got even worse.
ADAM STEER: Look, we could talk about that for a while, we could talk about Robodebt. But let's talk about gas reservation policy. A lot of gas, export gas, is sold in advance. How would it work to try and get a gas reservation when, particularly say, for example, here in the Northern Territory, that gas has already been sold, years in advance?
JAMES PATERSON: That's right. And those foundational contracts that have been sold in advance to those key export markets like Japan and Korea and China would not be touched. They make up about 1200 petajoules of our exports, and we're not proposing any changes to that. We consume on the east coast of Australia about 500 petajoules of gas and then a further about 300 in that short-term contracts and that short term spot market. And we're saying of that we're proposing to redirect 50 to 100 of those petajoules into the domestic east coast market to drive down prices. Now we think that can be accommodated within the existing market, and it will help make gas cheaper for Australians.
ADAM STEER: The charge will only be for the gas that's exported, right? Where exactly is the excess gas being produced at the moment?
JAMES PATERSON: You're right. So that gas which is exported as part of short-term contracts on the spot market, we're proposing that a small proportion of that, 50 to 100 petajoules, be redirected into the domestic market. But at the same time, we're also going to help increase the production of gas in two ways. One, we're going to help with the exploration and exploitation of gas that hasn't been taken advantage of. Two, we are going to make sure we speed up the process for approvals because they've been held up for years, and that is delaying bringing more gas into the market. So we think more supply plus quarantining some of it for the domestic market will drive those prices down.
ADAM STEER: James Paterson, good to talk to you. Thank you.
JAMES PATERSON: Thanks for having me.
ENDS