November 8, 2022
PETA CREDLIN: Joining me now Shadow Minister for Cyber Security and Countering Foreign Interference, Senator James Paterson. Senator, give us a sense of this issue. You raised it today in Senate estimates. What's going on?
JAMES PATERSON: Good evening, Peta, and thank you for your interest in this story. What's important about this Australian Strategic Policy Institute report is that it reveals really for the first time just how specific and targeted the online harassment is, particularly of young women, particularly of Asian descent, when they're working on issues that are critical of or sensitive to the Chinese Communist Party. So, without going into any graphic detail, to give your viewers a picture of what's going on here, really highly targeted artwork being created in China, which vilifies these women and men on platforms like Twitter, is endlessly put to them using bots hundreds of times a day. In fact, there was another instance of it targeting one of these women just today. And it has the purpose of trying to intimidate them and coerce them into silence to shut down the discussion in liberal democracies, particularly about the human rights abuses that are taking place in China, particularly those affecting the Uyghur people in Xinjiang, because the Chinese Communist
Party is very sensitive to this. It's also important that ASPI has very plausibly argued that this is highly likely to be done by Chinese intelligence services, and that is of great concern to me, and why I raised it in Senate estimates today.
CREDLIN: You pressed the issue with the Australian Signals Directorate, that's ASD for people at home, it's a specialist area of defence. Were you satisfied with their response?
PATERSON: Yes, I'm pleased that it's already on ASD's radar. And as the Director-General, Rachel Noble said, the ASD's role is more to defend the networks rather than the content of what's happening in Australia. I'll also be rising with the ASIO, our security intelligence organisation, which has a more direct mandate for foreign interference. They haven't yet appeared before estimates, but they'll be scheduled in a spill over hearing soon. I will be raising it with the Director-General, Mike Burgess, because I know he is concerned about this cyber-enabled foreign interference, which really is so far in our legislative framework an undealt with aspect of foreign interference. We've done very well in dealing with foreign interference into our political system and our political parties. We lead the world in doing that in 2018, but we've got more work to do because this can be very corrosive to our public debate if it silences the free speech of Australian citizens.
CREDLIN: Our spy agency ASIO says that foreign interference is supplanting terrorism as their greatest concern. What have you been able to find out from the other committees you’re sitting on?
PATERSON: This is very serious statement for ASIO to make given that terrorism remains a very serious risk. It is not a trivial risk that an Australian will suffer a loss of life or will be injured in a terrorist attack. So, for them to say that espionage and foreign interference is now an even greater national security concern, it is very alarming. I raised this with the Australian Federal Police today in the context that since those espionage and foreign interference laws were passed four years ago, only one person has been charged – that case is currently before the court so that person has not yet been convicted. Now I'm having difficulty reconciling ASIO's statement, which I believe to be true, with those lack of convictions. I put the AFP on notice that I've been watching this issue closely and that I expect them to enforce the law because the reason why we passed these laws is not just to deter people, which I think it has successfully done and not just to enable ASIO to disrupt these activities, which they have all so successfully done, but also to send a message that if you engage in these activities there will be serious consequences and I think will have a
very powerful effect if people start being charged, arrested, convicted and ultimately sent to jail for these crimes.
CREDLIN: Senator James Paterson, thank you.
ENDS
